“There actually isn’t much kindness in the film, and what is presented as acts of kindness are often the opposite,” he explained. “It’s thoughts about manipulation, power imbalance, control — what people do in order to feel loved and wanted, even if it isn’t really love… Whether it’s a boss offering structure to an employee or a cult leader offering a sensitive place and belonging to a woman whose life has changed, those things aren’t actually kind, so when I see the title and I think about the content, I guess it’s kind of ironic.”

“But there are some kindnesses,” Mamoudou countered. “There’s some hidden kindnesses in there that maybe don’t go well for them ultimately. There are some things in there that people do that is just out of the kindness of their heart and for no other reason.”

“That’s true; maybe I’m just being cynical,” Joe joked. 

“No, I’ve been cynical, too!” Mamoudou reasoned, before reflecting on what the title means to him personally. “Kindness is, in its purest form, selfless. It has nothing to do with: ‘What do I get out of this?’ It’s just: ‘How can I help?’ I find it really moving, even if somebody says: ‘I’m happy for you,’ I love telling people I’m happy for them because it’s not about me. I think that’s a kind of kindness; it’s just the energy being exchanged. There’s been 1,000 people that have helped me — not just in my career, but in my life in general — become a better person, and I consider those kinds of kindnesses.”

Finally, both stars expressed their hope that they would be invited to work with Yorgos again and become a part of his regular roster of stars.

“Hoping and wishing and praying and dreaming!” Mamoudou laughed with his fingers crossed. “Honestly, I’m not even joking.”

“It really did feel like an honor being invited back,” Joe added. “And similarly, I think, crossed fingers, I’d jump in and do it again if the opportunity’s ever there. Always.”

Here’s hoping that we will see Mamoudou and Joe reunited in a Yorgos movie at some point in the future.

Until then, Kinds of Kindness is in theaters across the United States now, and will be released in the UK and Ireland on June 28.

If you or someone you know has experienced sexual assault, you can call the National Sexual Assault Hotline at 1-800-656-HOPE (4673), which routes the caller to their nearest sexual assault service provider. You can also search for your local center here.